AoN_XSI Beta
Plugins linking to this thread: (hide)
AoN:XSI Beta
A work-in-progress (currently on hold but with very interesting results already) on
converting Thomas' well-known Project Messiah shaders to XSI. Includes:
AoN_Grid , AoN_Mixer, AoN_Distance, AoN_ReplaceAlpha. See the si-community discussion for a very detailed and illustrated introduction.
local backup: AoN_XSI.zip
AoN_Grid , AoN_Mixer, AoN_Distance, AoN_ReplaceAlpha. See the si-community discussion for a very detailed and illustrated introduction.
local backup: AoN_XSI.zip
author link: http://www.screendream.de/AoN_XSI.htm / author site: http://www.screendream.de / si-community thread
- ThomasHelzle
- Posts: 64
- Joined: 09 Jun 2009, 15:02
- Location: Berlin, Germany
- Contact:
Re: AoN_XSI Beta
Hi shushens,
no, such a shader isn't in there since I never need/use such a thing (I would always weight-paint that).
The shaders I release here are - as I said in the first statement - shaders I wrote over a longer period of time for my own use.
So this is NOT a "writing new shaders on demand" project ;-)
The work I currently do on them is just preparing them for mass consumption, not a rewrite or new development.
The package consists of procedurals and some helper tools.
Cheers,
Thomas Helzle
no, such a shader isn't in there since I never need/use such a thing (I would always weight-paint that).
The shaders I release here are - as I said in the first statement - shaders I wrote over a longer period of time for my own use.
So this is NOT a "writing new shaders on demand" project ;-)
The work I currently do on them is just preparing them for mass consumption, not a rewrite or new development.
The package consists of procedurals and some helper tools.
Cheers,
Thomas Helzle
- Hirazi Blue
- Administrator
- Posts: 5107
- Joined: 04 Jun 2009, 12:15
Re: AoN_XSI Beta
Fair point!!!ThomasHelzle wrote: So this is NOT a "writing new shaders on demand" project ;-)
But maybe "we" could interest you in creating something like a tutorial
based on your experiences with shader writing?
Stay safe, sane & healthy!
- ThomasHelzle
- Posts: 64
- Joined: 09 Jun 2009, 15:02
- Location: Berlin, Germany
- Contact:
Re: AoN_XSI Beta
Not at the moment.
There is only so much time in a day and there is so much other stuff in life to enjoy.
The spare time I have goes into the shader rework - or into replying to forum posts ;-)
But the basics are well covered in the shader 101 and 102 tutorials that are in the XSI wiki I think - everything above that is pretty specific to what you want to do and can't be shown in a tutorial.
If you are interested in the principles of procedurals, I would always recommend this book:
http://www.amazon.de/exec/obidos/ASIN/1 ... elzlges-21
The bible of noise in a way ;-)
From there it is experimenting, math and basic coding...
Cheers,
Thomas Helzle
There is only so much time in a day and there is so much other stuff in life to enjoy.
The spare time I have goes into the shader rework - or into replying to forum posts ;-)
But the basics are well covered in the shader 101 and 102 tutorials that are in the XSI wiki I think - everything above that is pretty specific to what you want to do and can't be shown in a tutorial.
If you are interested in the principles of procedurals, I would always recommend this book:
http://www.amazon.de/exec/obidos/ASIN/1 ... elzlges-21
The bible of noise in a way ;-)
From there it is experimenting, math and basic coding...
Cheers,
Thomas Helzle
- shushens
- Posts: 192
- Joined: 13 Jun 2009, 07:34
- Skype: shushens
- Location: Paderborn, Germany
- Contact:
Re: AoN_XSI Beta
Thanks for the clarification, Thomas. I did not assume this was an on-demand shader coding thread, but since you are really good, and no one else is prepared to do it, I thought I would request you anyway. Sorry for that.
My ill-maintained blog: http://visualdeceptions.info/blogger
- ThomasHelzle
- Posts: 64
- Joined: 09 Jun 2009, 15:02
- Location: Berlin, Germany
- Contact:
Re: AoN_XSI Beta
No need to be sorry ;)
I am not that good, honestly and MR is a pretty convoluted mass of undocumented, forgotten, abandoned, unfinished stuff so that I can only hope to manage to understand the basics.
I would guess that only half the code in MR actually DOES something other than slow it down
Hey, I'm kidding - I'm sure at least 60% of the code is useful for ... something?
Sorry, couldn't resist...
Since I'm mostly a 3D artist and only code if something is badly missing or doesn't work, I never got over a certain point of understanding, simply because I don't have the time.
Also, because I'm 100% self educated, this stuff is even harder to get into - I guess a "real" programmer has less of a hard time with the XSI and MR SDKs.
For me it is ;)
I wish you all a nice christmas!
Cheers,
Thomas
I am not that good, honestly and MR is a pretty convoluted mass of undocumented, forgotten, abandoned, unfinished stuff so that I can only hope to manage to understand the basics.
I would guess that only half the code in MR actually DOES something other than slow it down
Hey, I'm kidding - I'm sure at least 60% of the code is useful for ... something?
Sorry, couldn't resist...
Since I'm mostly a 3D artist and only code if something is badly missing or doesn't work, I never got over a certain point of understanding, simply because I don't have the time.
Also, because I'm 100% self educated, this stuff is even harder to get into - I guess a "real" programmer has less of a hard time with the XSI and MR SDKs.
For me it is ;)
I wish you all a nice christmas!
Cheers,
Thomas
Re: AoN_XSI Beta
Thomas, thank you for all your work on this very useful collection of textures and tools.
Your generosity is astounding, and very much appreciated!
Happy New Year!
Perry
Your generosity is astounding, and very much appreciated!
Happy New Year!
Perry
- ThomasHelzle
- Posts: 64
- Joined: 09 Jun 2009, 15:02
- Location: Berlin, Germany
- Contact:
Re: AoN_XSI Beta
Perry: Thank you for the kind words!
May you all have a superb 2010!!!
Today I uploaded a small update to the shaders that only concerns AoN_Grid:
- The node now has an additional output: "Alpha", where you can grab the scalar alpha value directly for whatever use you may have in mind. If you don't need/use the embedded alpha in the Color output, you can think of it as an additional value-independent output, that you - for instance - can use for displacement and dial in your low and high values directly with the alpha values of the A- and B-Colors (you can use negative numbers too!): - The second change is the addition of an additional Mode/Texture I called "Random Plaid", available in 2D and 3D: It is similar to "Random Grid", but it not only colors the fields randomly, but also scales them in a random way. It resulted from a happy accident when I was playing with some algorithms one day and I copied it to a text file back then, just to stumble over it lately and thinking that it would fit well into AoN_Grid
Here is an included preset using it that I called "Bubbly Plaid": Funny how the eye "thinks" that there is displacement when looking on the surfaces, while there isn't any!
Cheers and have fun!
Thomas Helzle
May you all have a superb 2010!!!
Today I uploaded a small update to the shaders that only concerns AoN_Grid:
- The node now has an additional output: "Alpha", where you can grab the scalar alpha value directly for whatever use you may have in mind. If you don't need/use the embedded alpha in the Color output, you can think of it as an additional value-independent output, that you - for instance - can use for displacement and dial in your low and high values directly with the alpha values of the A- and B-Colors (you can use negative numbers too!): - The second change is the addition of an additional Mode/Texture I called "Random Plaid", available in 2D and 3D: It is similar to "Random Grid", but it not only colors the fields randomly, but also scales them in a random way. It resulted from a happy accident when I was playing with some algorithms one day and I copied it to a text file back then, just to stumble over it lately and thinking that it would fit well into AoN_Grid
Here is an included preset using it that I called "Bubbly Plaid": Funny how the eye "thinks" that there is displacement when looking on the surfaces, while there isn't any!
Cheers and have fun!
Thomas Helzle
Re: AoN_XSI Beta
Very cool!
Is it possible to pass the random scale info on to UV's or in some way to not just randomly scale
a color, but also a texture (like a bitmap) plugged into the color ports?
I'm thinking of something along the lines of this:
http://www.3dlessons.com/tutorials/Text ... 94304.html
(even though I know your random grids don't use rotation)...
Even if it isn't possible, thank you for the cool update/upgrade to an awesome (and free) tool!
Perry
Is it possible to pass the random scale info on to UV's or in some way to not just randomly scale
a color, but also a texture (like a bitmap) plugged into the color ports?
I'm thinking of something along the lines of this:
http://www.3dlessons.com/tutorials/Text ... 94304.html
(even though I know your random grids don't use rotation)...
Even if it isn't possible, thank you for the cool update/upgrade to an awesome (and free) tool!
Perry
- ThomasHelzle
- Posts: 64
- Joined: 09 Jun 2009, 15:02
- Location: Berlin, Germany
- Contact:
Re: AoN_XSI Beta
Hi Perry,
I wrote such a shader long ago, but wasn't really that happy with the output because of some of the limitations of that technique so I never actually used it. Therefore I'm also not sure if I will ever finish/release it.
It is one of those concepts that sound cool in theory when you hear it but are not that useful in reality IMO. It can be very slow and it is so easy nowadays to create such a texture in Photoshop or Painter or ZBrush, that the pretty high render-overhead isn't worth it most of the time. The scaling involved leads often to not-so-hot results like in your link - a brickwall doesn't have that much difference in mortar-thickness, leaves don't scale linearly etc.
But if you want to play, remember that the oh so mighty "UVs" are nothing other than two gradients between 0 and 1 in the two directions along your texture space. If you "extract" them with a Texture_Projection_Lookup you can then do to them whatever you want in vector/scalar/colorspace, like for instance add the output of an AoN_Grid to it to offset parts of the texture.
That will not easily give you the results of such a dedicated shader, but it can be fun anyway
So to answer your question: No, it isn't possible to do what you want with the current shaders and it will never be part of those already available since it doesn't belong in there. If I will work on the above mentioned shader again is closer to "NO" ATM.
Sorry,
Thomas Helzle
I wrote such a shader long ago, but wasn't really that happy with the output because of some of the limitations of that technique so I never actually used it. Therefore I'm also not sure if I will ever finish/release it.
It is one of those concepts that sound cool in theory when you hear it but are not that useful in reality IMO. It can be very slow and it is so easy nowadays to create such a texture in Photoshop or Painter or ZBrush, that the pretty high render-overhead isn't worth it most of the time. The scaling involved leads often to not-so-hot results like in your link - a brickwall doesn't have that much difference in mortar-thickness, leaves don't scale linearly etc.
But if you want to play, remember that the oh so mighty "UVs" are nothing other than two gradients between 0 and 1 in the two directions along your texture space. If you "extract" them with a Texture_Projection_Lookup you can then do to them whatever you want in vector/scalar/colorspace, like for instance add the output of an AoN_Grid to it to offset parts of the texture.
That will not easily give you the results of such a dedicated shader, but it can be fun anyway
So to answer your question: No, it isn't possible to do what you want with the current shaders and it will never be part of those already available since it doesn't belong in there. If I will work on the above mentioned shader again is closer to "NO" ATM.
Sorry,
Thomas Helzle
- wireframex
- Posts: 399
- Joined: 08 Jun 2009, 23:02
- Location: France
Re: AoN_XSI Beta
Hi Thomas
I made the different update of AoN and with the last one I can only see 4 SPDL files see the picture above
Can you tell me what to do ?
Phil
I use Softimage 2010 x64
I made the different update of AoN and with the last one I can only see 4 SPDL files see the picture above
Can you tell me what to do ?
Phil
I use Softimage 2010 x64
"without mastery, power is nothing" - Softimage Addict User
CPU 3990x 128 Threads / 2 x 3090 RTX - 24 Go / 96 Go memory
CPU 3990x 128 Threads / 2 x 3090 RTX - 24 Go / 96 Go memory
- ThomasHelzle
- Posts: 64
- Joined: 09 Jun 2009, 15:02
- Location: Berlin, Germany
- Contact:
Re: AoN_XSI Beta
Looks correct to me?
Did you have more SPDLs before?
There are more shaders to go public over time, but for the moment those four are all there is.
The other screenshots were taken from my personal installation where I have more shaders, but those aren't ready for the masses ;-)
BTW. While working on the AoN_Turbulence shader which I thought would be ready a week ago, I realized that after all those years, some new algorithms would be cool to be included and some others should be overhauled, so it can take a while until there is another update, especially since I recently catched a nasty cold...
Cheers!
Thomas
Did you have more SPDLs before?
There are more shaders to go public over time, but for the moment those four are all there is.
The other screenshots were taken from my personal installation where I have more shaders, but those aren't ready for the masses ;-)
BTW. While working on the AoN_Turbulence shader which I thought would be ready a week ago, I realized that after all those years, some new algorithms would be cool to be included and some others should be overhauled, so it can take a while until there is another update, especially since I recently catched a nasty cold...
Cheers!
Thomas
- wireframex
- Posts: 399
- Joined: 08 Jun 2009, 23:02
- Location: France
Re: AoN_XSI Beta
strange affair, it seemed I had the most of these plugins in a update you post here ....ThomasHelzle wrote:Looks correct to me?
Did you have more SPDLs before?
Thomas
I must stop drinking now ;)
May be I used all of these too much with Project Messiah ...
Then I have to wait more
GO THOMAS GO !!!
Phil
"without mastery, power is nothing" - Softimage Addict User
CPU 3990x 128 Threads / 2 x 3090 RTX - 24 Go / 96 Go memory
CPU 3990x 128 Threads / 2 x 3090 RTX - 24 Go / 96 Go memory
Re: AoN_XSI Beta
Thomas, hope you get better soon.
Thank you for all the effort on this, for everyone's benefit!
I am sure it takes a lot of time, and on top of that, you are trying to add in more.
Very thankful.
Perry
Thank you for all the effort on this, for everyone's benefit!
I am sure it takes a lot of time, and on top of that, you are trying to add in more.
Very thankful.
Perry
- ThomasHelzle
- Posts: 64
- Joined: 09 Jun 2009, 15:02
- Location: Berlin, Germany
- Contact:
Re: AoN_XSI Beta
Dear AoN Users,
I am currently preparing for a bigger job that may keep me busy for more than a year if all goes well.
Therefore I can't tell if and when there will be more shaders coming for Mental Ray.
I am sorry, I didn't intend to leave this project less than half finished, but live always keeps some interesting stuff up the sleeves ;-)
And that's a truly wonderful thing
I wish you all the best for now and thank you for your support!
Cheers,
Thomas Helzle
I am currently preparing for a bigger job that may keep me busy for more than a year if all goes well.
Therefore I can't tell if and when there will be more shaders coming for Mental Ray.
I am sorry, I didn't intend to leave this project less than half finished, but live always keeps some interesting stuff up the sleeves ;-)
And that's a truly wonderful thing
I wish you all the best for now and thank you for your support!
Cheers,
Thomas Helzle
Who is online
Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 29 guests