the future? (was: the "frustration" thread)

[mattmos]

Just double-checked my subs invoice against last year - unit price of £775 per seat compared to £460 (plus tax of course). That's f***ing ridiculous. 70% increase??!!! I had 2 seats (for my fledgling company) and now will just have one on subscription. And thinking hard about that. Thanks for not providing a silver subscription Autodesk.

[xsisupport]

Just double-checked my subs invoice against last year - unit price of £775 per seat compared to £460 (plus tax of course). That's f***ing ridiculous. 70% increase??!!! I had 2 seats (for my fledgling company) and now will just have one on subscription. And thinking hard about that. Thanks for not providing a silver subscription Autodesk.

If you are renewing, my understanding is that you should be paying the same price as last year.

Here's a 3ds Max thread about the same thing. Look for the comments by Ken Pimental of Autodesk.
http://area.autodesk.com/forum/autodesk ... uk/page-4/

[mattmos]

Thanks for the link Steve, I've forwarded it to my reseller and am querying the price increase with them. Let's hope something comes out of it.

[Hirazi Blue]

If you are renewing, my understanding is that you should be paying the same price as last year.

The sad truth of our little "Price change imminent?" thread last year was
that the Subscription price (i.e. also renewing Subscription) in Europe got raised significantly as well.

Thomas Helzle quoted his German reseller:

Die Gold Subscription wird ebenfalls angepasst auf 900,00 € netto.

(Quoted from here)
...which obviously roughly translates as "Gold Subscription will also be changed to 900 € excluding VAT"

I hope that Stephen Blair is right, but in this rare case I doubt it...

edit - I mistakenly thought Mattmos' pricing was the same as mine...
UK pricing actually does seem higher. Sorry for the confusion.
(It's the VAT/no VAT thing that caught me off-guard)

[xsisupport]

If you are renewing, my understanding is that you should be paying the same price as last year.

The sad truth of our little "Price change imminent?" thread last year was
that the Subscription price (i.e. also renewing Subscription) in Europe got raised significantly as well.

Thomas Helzle quoted his German reseller:

Die Gold Subscription wird ebenfalls angepasst auf 900,00 € netto.

(Quoted from here)
...which obviously roughly translates as "Gold Subscription will also be changed to 900 € excluding VAT"

I hope that Stephen Blair is right, but in this rare case I doubt it... ;)

Everything I read here (eg FAQs on Subscription pricing) says the same thing:

This year, Subscription pricing increases apply to new seats only.

The cost of renewing an existing seat on Subscription will not increase until next year; however, any pricing decreases will be applied to Subscription renewals this year.

UPDATE: The price increases I refer to above were changes that went into effect on 27 March 2012.

[Hirazi Blue]

That might be so: but nobody told the resellers apparently. The price I paid just now for renewal was the new price...
Weird isn't it: Autodesk claims one thing and the resellers do something else...
;)

[Paulrus]

That might be so: but nobody told the resellers apparently. The price I paid just now for renewal was the new price...
Weird isn't it: Autodesk claims one thing and the resellers do something else...
;)

A good reason to dump the antiquated reseller network and get into the 21st century. Resellers were great back in the 1980's and early 90's, but what's the point anymore? I am giving someone a sales commission whom I've never met, only talked to once, never asked for help, never wanted to buy from, yet I must select them as my reseller.

Must be nice to be able to sit in an office somewhere and collect sales commissions without ever doing a thing...

-PG

[Bellsey]

That might be so: but nobody told the resellers apparently. The price I paid just now for renewal was the new price...
Weird isn't it: Autodesk claims one thing and the resellers do something else...
;)

That is odd, and I will look into it on my end. The resellers aren't allowed to really 'do their own thing', they should all understand the rules in which they have to operate. Our distributors are supposed to relay any information to them, however there can sometimes be a disconnect or delay.

@Paulrus - I agree.

[xsisupport]

That might be so: but nobody told the resellers apparently. The price I paid just now for renewal was the new price...
Weird isn't it: Autodesk claims one thing and the resellers do something else...
;)

Ok, here's the breakdown.

As many of you know, last year the price of Softimage Subscription in Europe went up a significant amount. This price increase basically put the price of Softimage Gold support on a comparable level with the price of Gold support on the other M&E products. Prices vary quite a bit by region in Europe, but for Hirazi Blue and much of Europe, this put the price of Softimage Gold support at 900 euros (up from 615, I believe it was).

This year, on 27 March 2012, Subscription prices changed again.

For Softimage Gold support, the price change was actually a modest decrease in price, from 900 to 890.

Because it was a decrease, 890 was the price Hirazi Blue paid to renew his Subscription.

Now, if the price had increased, for example to 910, Hirazi would not have paid the new price of 910 to renew. He would have paid the old price of 900.


In summary, here's how it works for the price increases that took effect on 27 March 2012:

• This year, the Subscription pricing increases apply to new seats only.
• The cost of renewing an existing seat on Subscription will not increase until next year; however, any pricing decreases will be applied to Subscription renewals this year.

[Hirazi Blue]

Yes, the confusion stemmed from my wrong assumption that the hefty price change we talked about last year was the last price change that happened (resulting in me calling the price before that the "old" price and the current price the "new" price). From that perspective I didn't understand what Stephen Blair meant until he added the specific date it applied to.
;;)

[mattmos]

So where does that leave me? With a 70% increase from last time i paid subscription? It's way beyond acceptable to me.

[Kerro Perro]

Well i didn't read this entire thread as don't want to get all worked up again but just want to say a couple of things:

I notice that AD is most definitely pushing Softimage - as a side-dish (for instance i was watching a recent SI webinar and you get Maya users asking asking question like: really can you model in Softimage? )

Also the Softimage team working with/on Arnold annoys me - yes spend time on something most small users can't get their hands on, great that...

Autodesk general stuff: have they ever heard of the term artist?? Nuff said.

But the most worrying is the crap about in the future not only using apps in the cloud but charging for older versions.

I've asked this before but no-one from AD seems to wanna answer this: Will we have to pay rent for licenses we already own?!

Luc-eric talking about SI income coming from subs here in this thread has my paranoia going again - if i let my sub run out will i be able to keep using this version without having to pay extra?

If not it would be a disgrace

[Bellsey]

I think the reason why ADSK haven't answered your question, is that there probably isn't a clear answer yet. As Marc Petit said following Carls comments, migrating the M&E products to the cloud isn't easy, so I don't think there's much point in second guessing anything, until ADSK actually have something offer.

[Kerro Perro]

I think the reason why ADSK haven't answered your question, is that there probably isn't a clear answer yet. As Marc Petit said following Carls comments, migrating the M&E products to the cloud isn't easy, so I don't think there's much point in second guessing anything, until ADSK actually have something offer.

Well this'll sound flippant but it's not funny: I'm not asking what they're gonna offer - i'm asking what they plan to take away!

Up until that interview i never got upset about anything Autodesk did or didn't do, in fact all AD employees i'd been in contact with have been very friendly and helpfull.... But to sell somebody a license and then take it away... Just the mere suggestion of that turns me nuts.

In fact since that interview and Ken Pimental being all patronizing on CGTalk i've started lookin into Blender and Modo, even though i'd like nothing better than to keep working with Softimage till my arms fall off - score one for AD marketing there...

[xsisupport]

Well i didn't read this entire thread as don't want to get all worked up again but just want to say a couple of things:

I notice that AD is most definitely pushing Softimage - as a side-dish (for instance i was watching a recent SI webinar and you get Maya users asking asking question like: really can you model in Softimage? )

Also the Softimage team working with/on Arnold annoys me - yes spend time on something most small users can't get their hands on, great that...

Autodesk general stuff: have they ever heard of the term artist?? Nuff said.

But the most worrying is the crap about in the future not only using apps in the cloud but charging for older versions.

I've asked this before but no-one from AD seems to wanna answer this: Will we have to pay rent for licenses we already own?!

Luc-eric talking about SI income coming from subs here in this thread has my paranoia going again - if i let my sub run out will i be able to keep using this version without having to pay extra?

If not it would be a disgrace

If your Subscription expires, you still have your license and it is a permanent license, and you can continue to use the most recent version you obtained under Subscription. You don't have to pay extra to keep using it.

Previous version usage, however, is a Subscription benefit. If you are on Subscription, your 2013 license includes licenses for 2012, 2011, and 2010. If you are not on Subscription, you can continue to use those previous versions for 120 days after your Subscription expires. After that, the terms of the License Agreement do not allow for previous version usage. It's always been like that (well, as long as I have been at Autodesk, which is now 3+ years).

Update: If you have a network license and you are on Subscription, the license file includes license tokens for the current version and the three previous versions. If you have a standalone license under Subscription, you can request activation codes for the previous versions.

[Hirazi Blue]

So where does that leave me? With a 70% increase from last time i paid subscription? It's way beyond acceptable to me.

The way I understand it now (but these kind of issues are way too confusing to me to say anything with any certainty): the main price change for Softimage Subscription (the one that pushed my "Dutch" subscription to about 900 Euro, and the price change seems to have been even steeper in the UK) took place before the price change Stephen Blair was talking about (27th of March), so the fact that renewal prices weren't affected (or got 10 Euro cheaper even) in that last round of price changes doesn't apply to the full force of the "main" price change. In other words, you are scr**ed (as are we all).

If your Subscription expires, you still have your license and it is a permanent license, and you can continue to use the most recent version you obtained under Subscription. You don't have to pay extra to keep using it.

But (please tell me I'm mistaken ) won't Autodesk at a certain point in the future stop issuing licenses for that year's version of the software (like they did a while back for the old xsi licenses, for instance), making it nearly impossible to install it on new hardware at a later date? Oh, I so hope I am mistaken...
;)